Author Topic: hard cast vs. soft point in .357 magnum  (Read 3489 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline t-reg

  • Trade Count: (1)
  • Avid Poster
  • **
  • Posts: 115
hard cast vs. soft point in .357 magnum
« on: April 29, 2009, 10:25:35 am »
How does the performance of a 158 gr jacketed soft point bullet campare to that of a 158 gr hard cast lswc on deer and pigs?  Velocity is appx 1200 fps.

 

Graybeard Outdoors

hard cast vs. soft point in .357 magnum
« on: April 29, 2009, 10:25:35 am »
 

Offline stubshaft

  • Trade Count: (8)
  • Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 490
  • ROA's Rule
Re: hard cast vs. soft point in .357 magnum
« Reply #1 on: April 29, 2009, 08:21:18 pm »
Neither one of them expand unless you hit bone and the velocity is high.  Depending on the diameter of the meplat (WNFGC) the SWC can be much more efficient than the JSP.  Better hydrostatic shock and penetration.
If I agreed with you then we would both be wrong.

Offline Ak.Hiker

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 389
Re: hard cast vs. soft point in .357 magnum
« Reply #2 on: April 29, 2009, 11:33:11 pm »
Not sure about the penetration on hogs but when testing over the years in spruce wood the hard cast have gone through more wood than the JSP's. I have noticed that some JSP bullets are tougher than others. The Speer Unicore is pretty tough with a very small lead tip. I would bet the Unicore would hold up pretty well on game.

Offline Mikey

  • GBO Supporter
  • Moderator
  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8838
Re: hard cast vs. soft point in .357 magnum
« Reply #3 on: April 30, 2009, 03:40:44 am »
Hardcast bullets should not deform, hence the design to maximize the frontal impact area.  Jacketed soft point bullets are good for whitetail and hog, but I gave up jacketed slugs long ago in favor of the non-expanding cast bullet.

I have used 357 mag 200 gn Keith style semi-wadcutters on hog up to 250 lb and had them bust through shoulders and pass through, bringing the animal down.  I have also used 158 gn jacketed slugs successfully on whitetail with broadside pass throughs with success but prefer hardcast.

However, Jerry Lester is our 357 magnum expert and I believe he prefers the 125 gn jacketed soft point from a rifle/carbine and the 158 gn jacketedsoft point from his revolver, and he has tons (literally) of whitetail under his belt.  HTH.

Offline handi243

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (55)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1128
Re: hard cast vs. soft point in .357 magnum
« Reply #4 on: April 30, 2009, 05:54:00 pm »
Mickey i think your right i'm sure Jerry will be along soon to chime in. By the way i like the 158 jsp's haven't lost one yet.

Offline Mohawk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1958
Re: hard cast vs. soft point in .357 magnum
« Reply #5 on: April 30, 2009, 08:32:03 pm »
 Haven't used the SWC's or JSP's in the .357 Mag for deer but have used the 158gr SJHP (Semi-Jacketed Hollow Point) on whitetail and it worked just fine and even received pass-thru's on the two deer I killed with them. Exit holes were around .50-.60 caliber, right where they should be, and both uses were broadside with semi-sharp angles in regards to trajectory. First deer was quartering but the bullet still did excellent. And this was from a 4" barreled revolver.

Offline timothy

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 267
Re: hard cast vs. soft point in .357 magnum
« Reply #6 on: May 05, 2009, 08:30:36 pm »
I did some very informal penetration tests using factory magtech 158gr jsp rated at 1250fps and a handload of 158gr swc with a max charge of lil gun and suprisingly they both penetrated the same number of wood boards. I think the trick is to choose the right bullet for the application, but if ever in doubt go hardcast with the widest meplate you can find. The only advantage to a jacketed bullet imho is to kill quicker, saving the game time suffering. With a little research you can get a pretty good idea of what a bullet will do and go from there. Good luck

Offline Lloyd Smale

  • Moderators
  • Trade Count: (32)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12330
Re: hard cast vs. soft point in .357 magnum
« Reply #7 on: May 06, 2009, 04:16:37 am »
the 357 is sort of a marginal caliber for big game hunting. Now before everyone starts jumping up and down i said sort of. Ive killed big game with them myself and it can be made to work. One thing its got going against it is a small frontal area. If using hardcast it might be a good time to try wfns. I usually detest them but they are probably the ideal cast bullet for a 357. For deer about any jackted bullet of a 150 grain or more should work fine. Probably better then a cast bullet. For pigs using jackted you may want to step up to a premium jacketed bullet like a partition. There bigger boned then deer and have a tough grizzle shield that ive seen stop jackted handgun bullets. Personaly i like a bigger gun and personaly id skip right on past the 41 too. A 44 mag or a 45 colt shooting cast bullets is a much better proposition.
sixgun addict

Offline t-reg

  • Trade Count: (1)
  • Avid Poster
  • **
  • Posts: 115
Re: hard cast vs. soft point in .357 magnum
« Reply #8 on: May 06, 2009, 07:34:07 pm »
Thanks for the replys gentlemen.  Lloyd, I agree that the .357 is sort of marginal.  Part of the reason for doing it is the challenge.  I've shot many deer with .44 mags and am a real believer in hard cast bullets. Thats all I used for years on 25+ deer.  Now I've got this .357 that doesn't seem to like hard cast LSWC.  Tried 4 powders, 3 primers and 3 bullet brands.   I like what I've read about LBT style WFN's so normaly I'd begin testing with those or have the gun modified to shoot LSWC.   Now I'm layed off and can't really justify the money for experimenting like that.  My gun has however shot jacketed bullets very well and from what I read here on GBO a SP bullet ahould work well.  So, I'll get some, work up a good, accurate load and carry them with confidence that within the limits of the .357 mag they will get the job done. 

Is there a brand that is known to work better than others?   I'm leaning towards Remingtons for easy cross over to HP's.

Offline Ak.Hiker

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 389
Re: hard cast vs. soft point in .357 magnum
« Reply #9 on: May 06, 2009, 10:00:52 pm »
In my own bullet testing the Speer 158 grain Unicore seems to hold together well. It may be worth looking at.

Offline Mikey

  • GBO Supporter
  • Moderator
  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8838
Re: hard cast vs. soft point in .357 magnum
« Reply #10 on: May 07, 2009, 04:10:25 am »
t-reg:  your 357 should shoot just about any bullet equally well.  I would ask which particular 357 you have, whether it was purchased new or used and how many rounds youhave down the tube.  I would also ask if your barrel leads up after shooting cast and whether you have ever measured your bore and used properly sized slugs.

I have never had a problem with the 357 and whitetail; even at 50 yds the 200 gn passes through on chest shots or will bust a shoulder and then pass on through.  Just about every whitetail I have taken with that slug in the 357 reacts like it had been hit by a rifle bullet and unless I bust a shoulder to hobble it up, it will run a bit before piling up. 

When you speak to having your revolver modified to shoot lswc slugs, are you speaking about having the forcing cone relieved and lapping the bore???

Offline t-reg

  • Trade Count: (1)
  • Avid Poster
  • **
  • Posts: 115
Re: hard cast vs. soft point in .357 magnum
« Reply #11 on: May 07, 2009, 09:46:54 am »
Mikey, it's a 4" Security Six, unfired until I got ahold of it.  I've sent about 500 rounds down the tube, both cast and jacketed, and yes, it leads.  A .358" dia bullet slips snugly thru the throats.  However I've not actually measured the bore dia of the throats or the barrel, yet.

Quote
When you speak to having your revolver modified to shoot lswc slugs, are you speaking about having the forcing cone relieved and lapping the bore???
 

Yes, and properly sizing the throats to the bore dia of the barrel if need be. 


I am glad to hear the positive responses to using .357 w/ SP bullets on deer and hogs.

Offline S.S.

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2844
Re: hard cast vs. soft point in .357 magnum
« Reply #12 on: May 10, 2009, 10:09:15 am »
I use a moderately hard cast SWC of 158 grains. With most handgun hunting,
as long as I do my part, it is perfectly adequate. I prefer a 6 or 8 inch barrel though.
Vir prudens non contra ventum mingit
"A wise man does not pee against the wind".

Offline Graybeard

  • Administrator
  • Trade Count: (69)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 22955
  • Gender: Male
Re: hard cast vs. soft point in .357 magnum
« Reply #13 on: May 10, 2009, 01:09:17 pm »
Beg, borrow or steal some bullets from a Lyman 358156 GC mould sized to .358" or .359" and if they don't shoot accurately over a max dose of 2400 then the gun has major problems that need to be attended to. I've seen them advertised by some commercial casters but can't recall who. You'd likely need to buy from someone who hand casts rather than machine casts their bullets.


Bill aka the Graybeard


I am not a lawyer and do not give legal advice.

Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life anyone who believes in Him will have everlasting life!

Offline BrianB

  • Trade Count: (3)
  • Avid Poster
  • **
  • Posts: 192
Re: hard cast vs. soft point in .357 magnum
« Reply #14 on: May 14, 2009, 09:15:07 am »
I haven't used cast bullets on deer, yet.  But, my son dropped a small buck two years ago using a GP100 6" with a 158gr Hornady XTP over 16gr of Lil' Gun at about 30 yards.  When I say dropped, I mean dropped. Total pass-through in the chest with a good exit wound. I get under 1'' groups with this combo at 30 yards.  In the future I'm probably going to switch to a 180gr XTP just for the little extra weight.

Offline t-reg

  • Trade Count: (1)
  • Avid Poster
  • **
  • Posts: 115
Re: hard cast vs. soft point in .357 magnum
« Reply #15 on: May 14, 2009, 09:37:01 am »
Quote
Beg, borrow or steal some bullets from a Lyman 358156 GC mould sized to .358" or .359"

Thanks for the recomendation GB.  Someday I'll get set up and mold my own.

 

go2gbo.com Webutation