Lots of toggle tops at the show today

[1911crazy]

There was lots of toggle tops at the gun show today(Big E West Springfield, Mass) but I never stopped to price them at all.   I figure they beyond what I would pay for them anyway.             BigBill

[NRAJOE]

Okay, whats a toggle top?  :oops:  :shock:

[Mikey]

NRAJOE - a 'toggle top' is the term used to refer to the Luger pistol.  You sometimes see them referred to as 'knuckle actions' or 'knuckle tops'.  Lots of folks confuse the term Luger to mean the 9x19 Luger or 9x19 Parabellum cartridge.  There is the Luger pistol, or in the correct nomenclature, the P08 Pistol or P08 Luger, and then there is the 2nd cartridge it was chambered for, the 9x19mm (or 9mm Luger/9mm Parabellum).  The first cartridge it was chambered for is the 7.65mm Luger, which looks like a 9x21 length cartridge necked to 7.65 mm, and fires a 93 grain (.310 diameter) boolet at a stated velocity of 1280'/sec.  HTH.  Mikey.

Hay BigBill - Yo!  Mikey.

[NRAJOE]

After I posted that, I got to thinking that that probably was what he was talking about...thanks for the info.  :grin:

[1911crazy]

Sorry I don't check all my posts that often I forget, yes its a 9mm luger the guy had a rack full of them.  Whats a fair price for a 9mm luger??                                                                BigBill

[Mikey]

BigBill Ol Buddy - go easy with those Lugers, you can get screwed badly if you do not know what you are looking for, or at.  Many look very nice, but you need to (1) check the bore for pitting - if the thing is a war relic it is liable to have a bad bbl and you do not want that one.  Same applies to the chambers - the Third Reich used corrosive ammo and quite often those Lugers carried in the field did not get the maintenance they needed.  (2) The mainsprings on those things (coil springs) are/were quite often set for heavier loads, such as the 125 gn load at about 1100'/sec.  Some American made ammo will not function them and you will either have to remove a coil from the spring or go to heavier (please notice my Friend that I said heavier, not hotter) loads to get them to function properly.  (3) The firing pins on those things are not made for dry-firing - it you want to dry fire one, make certain you have a dead casing in the chamber with a dead primer in it to soften the blow on the firing pin.  (4) Sometimes the triggers on those things will give you headaches.  If you do not find one with matching #s, the trigger may well give you fits - as you depress the trigger, it depresses a lever on the side plate which depresses the trigger release bar on the slide and if the gun has wear, you may have to deeeeeeeeepressssssss before it trips off fer ya.  Also, some have a lot of trigger after let off travel that makes accuracy a pita.  

If youget a good one, they can be very accurate.  The major prollem with those is that they have not been made in many decades and the metal may be fatigued, making them not all that safe with modern loadings.  Lugers are beauties, but unless you know the particular piece, you may not want to date one.  Also, there are many unscrupulous dealers out there who will dig into your wallet for max $, give you no guarrantee on what you buy, may sell you a clunkin' lunker, and be glad they got rid of it while you're trying to figure out how to make it work.  

A good workable functioning Luger with a good bore, matching numbers, nice grips (which don't come loose), no external pitting, good springs, etc., will likely run you $600 or better.  HTH Buddy, let me know if you run across one you like.