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teamnelson 04-06-2019 08:26 PM

Praying in Jesus' Name
 
Clearly a few folks here believe that unless a spoken prayer included "in Jesus name" at the end of it, it isn't prayer. From what scripture passages is that idea taken? Where is the idea come from that those 3 words, verbally spoken, are a requirement for prayer?

This is the bible study section, not the religious section, so scriptural justification is expected.

teamnelson 04-07-2019 01:12 AM

Guess I'll start.

Jesus indicates that if we receive a child "in Jesus name" we receive him (Matthew 18:5, Mark 9:37, Luke 9:48). Would we say that unless "I receive you in Jesus name" is uttered out loud in a public setting, we have not been obedient?

Jesus says that if we are gathered together in His name, that He will be with us also (Matthew 18:20). Does he not join us until we formally and verbally state aloud for all to hear "we are gathered together in Jesus name"?

If we say that we must use the words "in Jesus name" in order for a prayer to have been in Jesus name, then it must follow that we must do the same when receiving a child, or gathering together. In fact, even more so in those cases since the clear teaching on how to pray does not say anything about it being "in Jesus name." (Matthew 6:9-13) but those other two events do.

But there also two times when Jesus talks about people praying in His name, that are not "true Christians." First, in Matthew 7:21-23, there are those who prayed in Jesus name to cast out demons, and prophesy, and do many mighty works. But Jesus rejects them, says He doesn't know them, and they are workers of iniquity. Second, in Matthew 24:5, Mark 13:6, Luke 21:8, it says that there will be those who come "in Jesus name" who will lead people astray.

It seems then that the phrase "in Jesus name" is not a sure mark of a "true christian", and saying it aloud doesn't tell us anything about the trueness of the speaker. It follows that to add verbally stating those 3 words as a requirement for a true prayer is not something scripture offers as a litmus test of christian authenticity.

In John 14:13, Jesus said to His disciples, “Whatever you ask in My name, that I will do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.” And in John 16:24: “Until now, you have asked nothing in my name. Ask and you will receive that your joy may be full.”

So we are called to ask, which suggests prayer, and in Jesus name. But notice already the asking is restrained to two things: the glory of the father in the son, and the fullness of our joy.

So we cannot just ask for anything; what we ask for must be for God's glory and our joy.

Who do we ask? Jesus taught his disciples to pray to the Father ... not to Himself, or to the Holy Spirit. To the Father.

So we are told to go to the Father, and ask Him that He would be glorified in His son, and our joy may be full. But Jesus doesn't say in the Matthew passage to be sure to add "in Jesus name" as a book end to "our father". So praying in Jesus name must mean something different than saying 3 words.

Revelation 3:12 The one who conquers, I will make him a pillar in the temple of my God. Never shall he go out of it, and I will write on him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, the new Jerusalem, which comes down from my God out of heaven, and my own new name.

The Christian has the name of Jesus written upon him. This matches the entire story of the Old Testament where God declares Israel, a people called by His name, set apart by His name, marked by His name. Being in Jesus name is about identity, not incantation. You cannot pray, approach the Father's throne with a petition, unless you bear the name of Jesus ... are washed in His blood, imputed His righteousness. It does not matter what you say, even if you say "in Jesus name", unless you are already wearing Jesus name upon your heart (Matthew 7:21-23). But if you are wearing Jesus name, you can approach the throne of grace in His name, with confidence.

Every time a Christian prays, they are praying "in Jesus name" because they cannot approach the throne in their own name, regardless of the words used. Because a Christian is not praying for the sake of those listening to what they say, like the Pharisees on the street, nor are they praying in their own will and purpose. They are praying "thy will be done" to the Father, through and in the Son. No man comes to the Father except through/in Jesus.

Jesus himself modeled this idea in His earthly ministry when He said that He came in the name of His Father, and He worked in His Father's name. John 5:43, John 10:25. He did not audibly say "in the name of my Father" when he prayed, or when he healed, cast our demons, or did any other thing. He was already "in the name of His Father." He simply prayed, healed, cast out demons, etc. But when asked he specifically said that he was doing those things in the name of His Father. He did not have to say it in order for his work to be true.

If you've ever been the executor of a will, which is derived from this ancient understanding of what it meant to be in someone else's name, or had a power of attorney, then you understand what this means. For the specific purpose of your role as executor, you are able to approach authorities "in the name of" the deceased, to close out accounts, distribute assets, sign checks, etc. Without the formal appointment, you cannot claim to be doing anything in the name of anyone. You can go to the bank and say I am here in the name of Graybeard until you are blue in the face, but you're not going draw a single penny out of his account. If you show up with a power of attorney, and proper id, well then come on in, how much do you want?

Every prayer of a Christian is "in Jesus name" whether they say it aloud or not for you to hear. Is it useful to say aloud to remind ourselves of that when we pray? Absolutely. Is it required? No. Only being in Jesus name is required, saying it doesn't mean anything unless you are wearing His name on your heart.

A better question to ask ourselves instead of have you said the words, is did you pray as one who wears Jesus name? Is it praying "in Jesus name" to pray for something that does not glorify God or bring you the fulness of joy? Can we say a prayer is good because they said "in Jesus name" when it was not a reflection of the will and purpose of the Father or the Son? When I'm worried about praying in Jesus name, I think about my heart not my lips.

Dee 04-07-2019 07:05 AM

Your right, I misunderstood, and was wrong.

Moose Ears 04-07-2019 08:05 AM

Very good teaching on having His name. The only problem: Jesus is not His name! He is Yeshua. He is not of Greek or English origin, but Hebrew. The 1611 KJV called Him Iesous, which is of Greek origin and is nothing more than a form of the word for the Greek god Zeus. His name was intentionally changed or modified to disassociate Him from His Jewishness. The scriptures tell us in Acts 4:11-12 that there is only one name given unto men under Heaven for salvation. The name Yeshua means "salvation"! Matthew 1:21 tells the meaning of the name Yeshua. The word Jesus means nothing except rejection of His real name. The letter "J" is only about 400yrs old, by the way.

bugeye 04-07-2019 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by teamnelson (Post 2055873720)

In John 14:13, Jesus said to His disciples, “Whatever you ask in My name, that I will do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.” And in John 16:24: “Until now, you have asked nothing in my name. Ask and you will receive that your joy may be full.”

So we cannot just ask for anything; what we ask for must be for God's glory and our joy.



First, if you pray, other than in your closet, it should be in Jesus' name for a very simple reason; Someone in your audience might ask, is he praying to the muslim god??
Or is he praying to ganesha the elephant god, or buddha, or hare krishna, you get the idea.
IMO, if you leave out HIS name it sounds like you're ashamed to be a Christian.
I wear the badge proudly, because he is my Savior. Savior, you know what that means to me, it means eternity in His presence.
We cannot give credence to any other religion or we belittle Jesus.
why would anyone take a stupid chance with their eternity.
I know that some preachers and chaplins treat the Bible like it was written by lawyers, but, the NT is written in plain language so that dummies like me can work out our Salvation with fear and trembling.

Second, as I mentioned to pastorp recently, I never pray for myself except to ask for forgiveness or ask for wisdom as I study his word.
My prayers are for thanksgiving, for GODs glory, and for blessings on others.
All that said, GOD has blessed my wife and I abundantly.

I know you asked for scripture, but you seem to have done quite well in that area, so I don't feel obligated.
I've read the NT over and over, and there's nothing in there that gives me the green light to pray in any way except in the name MY SAVIOR.

It's just common sense to me.

teamnelson 04-08-2019 04:09 AM

bugeye, the only part where you and i differ is requiring the 3 words "in Jesus name." be spoken.

bugeye 04-08-2019 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by teamnelson (Post 2055874194)
bugeye, the only part where you and i differ is requiring the 3 words "in Jesus name." be spoken.

Yeah maybe.
I posted in another thread the reason I do as I do.
You said that Jesus did not instruct us to pray in HIS name, and that's true, but, at the time of his instructions, his time had not come and everyone he was talking to, who were Godly types, were Jews.
HIS time came at the instant of his death when the curtain in the temple split in half, and his followers at that moment became Christians.
So, I would not participate in any prayer, of any religion, except Christianity in Christ's name.
I feel that is denying Jesus' sovereignty over all things, which IMO is blasphemy.

teamnelson 04-08-2019 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bugeye (Post 2055874338)
Yeah maybe.
I posted in another thread the reason I do as I do.
You said that Jesus did not instruct us to pray in HIS name, and that's true, but, at the time of his instructions, his time had not come and everyone he was talking to, who were Godly types, were Jews.
HIS time came at the instant of his death when the curtain in the temple split in half, and his followers at that moment became Christians.
So, I would not participate in any prayer, of any religion, except Christianity in Christ's name.
I feel that is denying Jesus' sovereignty over all things, which IMO is blasphemy.


You do not believe saying "in the Name that is above all other names" (Philippians 2:9) exclusively references Jesus?


If a lost person prays and ends it with "in Jesus name" ... is that prayer, or are they just talking with their eyes closed?


The verses in my original post indicate that when a Christian prays, it is in Jesus name, whether they say it or not. I personally pray a lot without ever opening my mouth. Not verbalizing "in Jesus name" does not deny the sovereignty of Jesus, simply because the only means by which we can pray in the first place is from being in Jesus. Otherwise, its just words, which according to scripture can include "in Jesus name" and at the same time deny His sovereignty.


I understand and agree that words matter, and 99% of the time, as a Chaplain, my prayers are in the context of worship service, study, discipleship or counseling, at which time I always verbalize in Jesus name, Christ's name, the matchless name of Jesus, etc. The other less than 1% of the time, I am not offering prayers in fellowship of believers; I am being asked to pray at a Commanding Officer's mandatory formation, where non-believers are ordered to attend, and their religious freedoms under the Constitution of our nation, which we all took an oath to defend, requires that they not be forced to participate in a religious service. Its not a religious service. Its a national tradition, and so as my predecessors have done since the ink was wet on our Declaration of Independence, I pray to the "Eternal Father, Almighty God" ... "in the Name that is above all other names, Amen." with full confidence that as a Christian I am honoring the sovereignty of Christ, without violating the religious freedoms of other Patriotic Americans who are willing to die so that you and I can go to whichever church we want to on Sunday.

goodshot 04-08-2019 07:07 PM

Thank you dear friend and brother in Christ.

bugeye 04-08-2019 07:28 PM

170 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by teamnelson (Post 2055874510)
You do not believe saying "in the Name that is above all other names" (Philippians 2:9) exclusively references Jesus?

TN, I'm not a lawyer, so I do not use scriptures like above to skirt any issues.
When I pray, even to myself, their is no doubt by anyone who's name I am praying in.

You will never convince me that leaving out HIS name is okay.
I could not be a military chaplin, because I would not belittle Jesus by making some generic prayer to satisfy the brass and the attendees who couldn't care less about Jesus.

I just know, that when I am judged, I won't have to try and make excuses for not giving credit where credit is due. And Jesus, who came to this earth to suffer horrible punishment and a horrible death on the cross, for ME, gets the credit for bearing my sins and giving me a chance of an eternity with HIM.


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