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Won't.

Most knowledgeable folks refuse to chamber any of the short or long magnums from Winchester or Remington in Encores. They are not considered safe in them.
 

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iunderpressure, You are correct, MGM does chamber for a 358 WSSM. This is NOT a factory round, but is made by opening the neck up on the WSSM case. Being that it is not a factory loaded round, the pressures are whatever you make them. I've heard of a few people who have them and are well satisfied. But if you're not a experienced reloader I would suggest maybe something else. ( 358 Win/356 Win ) From what I've heard they are used by hunters in a state ( IN ?? ) that requires a cartridge case under a certain length (for bottleneck cartridges) to be legal. As Graybeard suggested the FACTORY available WSSM rounds as loaded by the factory are too high pressure for the Encore and MGM will not chamber for them ( Although you may still find some older barrels floating around out there that were made before the problems were known ).
 

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Most knowledgeable folks refuse to chamber any of the short or long magnums from Winchester or Remington in Encores. They are not considered safe in them.
???

Are you guys thinking Contenders?? Cause Encores can handle them. From TC's website (aka they chamber them): there's the 7mm Rem Mag, 300 & 338 Win Mag, 375 H&H, and 416 Rigby to name a few.

Gary Reeder's shop is about a mile from my house and he builds some serious hand cannons on Encores.

Contenders are another story...

Mike
 

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Elkoholic said:
Most knowledgeable folks refuse to chamber any of the short or long magnums from Winchester or Remington in Encores. They are not considered safe in them.
???

Are you guys thinking Contenders?? Cause Encores can handle them. From TC's website (aka they chamber them): there's the 7mm Rem Mag, 300 & 338 Win Mag, 375 H&H, and 416 Rigby to name a few.

Gary Reeder's shop is about a mile from my house and he builds some serious hand cannons on Encores.

Contenders are another story...

Mike
Graybeard was referring to the beltless magnum cartridges. These cartridges all come from the same basic parent case, 404 Jeffery. These are loaded to a much higher pressure in order to obtain the higher velocities which are not safe for the Thompson Center Encore.

Remington’s:
RUM = Remington Ultra Magnum
SAUM = Short Action Ultra Magnum
Winchester’s
WSM = Winchester Short Magnum
WSSM = Winchester Super Short Magnum

yooper77
 

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Alot of calibers for here

http://www.bullberry.com/encore.html

http://www.matchgrademachine.com/chamberings_public.php


I tried to copy why (censored word) won't chamber for the short mag etc
try again


No short mags!
No super short mags,
No compact mags,
No ultra mags,
Nothing high pressure larger in diameter than .512" at the head of the case, the approximate diameter of the H&H headsize above the belt.

I get requests for these daily. They are too much for the Encore and stretch the frame too much. The Encore is NOT the equivalent of any decent modern bolt action and will not handle the additional force exerted from the larger diameter chambers.

It is a matter of pounds per square inch. The cross section of a mag chamber at .512," for example, is a larger fraction of a square inch than, say, a .308 Winchester chamber at .470" and therefore exerts more force out the back of the barrel.

I like to use the reverse analogy of your lawn mower engine and your car engine. Both use approximately the same octane fuel and the same approx. 15 to 1 air to fuel ratio, but to get MORE force on the crank your car engine pistons are much larger in diameter. The pressure inside the cylinder is the same, but the surface area of the piston is greater.

In your car engine, you WANT more force. In your break open actions you must minimize the force out the "cylinder" by the "piston'" the cartridge case. To do that, you stay with the smaller diameter cartridge/chamber.

There are more reasons NOT to chamber for the large, high pressure rounds, one of which is the depth of the screw holes in the barrel over the chamber.

The other is that even if good sense does not prevail and you do chamber for one of the large diameter, high pressure rounds, to avoid stretching the frame you have to either long throat the barrel to reduce pressure or you have to download it to the point it may not produce as much velocity as a smaller diameter cartridge that is acceptable.

The "short fat" and hot mags should be reserved for bolt action guns or stronger fixed barrel single shots, NOT the Encore.

You have much greater issues to be concerned about than a few extra feet per second to plow up Mother Earth with a bigger furrow when you miss.

Focus on accuracy and dependability of the TC system first!

Then respect the gun for its worth rather than stretching things to the limit!

Shoot Smart!

Don't do dumb things.

Mike Bellm
 

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Thanks for the clarification!

I've never really payed much attention the new short mags to even remember they're beltless.

Reeder builds alot on the 405 winchester and 577 Snider (among others). Don't know what
kind of pressures he tops out at.

Thanks!
Mike
 

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What about 350 Remington.
Basicly a 308 length 375 H&H necked to 358.
Was designed for the 600 mohawk carbine.
ballistics of 35 Whelan or a little better.
But then why not just get 35 Whelan?
Or if you want a heavy brush rifle go with 375H&H. Just reload it down with the 270 or 300 grain bullets or go with lighter bullets like the 235 grainers.
 

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Also a Hoosier, and realize this is an older post.......my apologies if that is an issue.

My quest for a legal round in Indiana is a bit different......I guess because I am too. LOL
AND A TIGHTWAD.

The WSM and WSSM rounds are larger in diameter and hold a little bit more powder than mine, however the entire gunsmith bill for mine is less than dies for the 358 WSSM, custom ones anyway. I think Redding did come out with a run of them.

Being a remington NUT, and lover of the main squeeze of the Remington nutcase hoard, the 700 Remington, I wanted a round IN THAT RIFLE to hunt my remaining years here in Indiana.

I also did NOT want to pay for a custom replacement barrel..........or custom dies.

as I said....TIGHTWAD! (aka poor, lol)

A replacement barrel could be found to rechamber, on the used, cheaper side, but.....eh, I wanted a very nice 700. Nothing wrong with a single shot and love the idea of using one but I wanted what I wanted and figured out how to get there on my budget.

Yep........had to buy a rifle. Would anyway for a legal IN round but this is what I did.

I picked up a (actually two) 700 Remington classic in 350 Remington mag. No barrel replacement needed.

Instead of necking up or down and trimming lengths, I just had my 'smith put in an order with PT&G for a "350 Remington mag shortened to 1.795" and kept the factory neck length (another thing I dont personally care for on the WSSM rounds), shoulder angle.......the whole nine, and just shortened it .375 inches. With a factory capacity of 73 grains for the 350 RM.....I figured I "had room" for my purposes.

Simple set back and rechamber.
Take Redding standard 350 Rem mag sizing die and trim die (for forming brass) and shortened them .375 inches. The seater die stem will adjust down far enought to seat bullets as is.

Literally any belted mag brass from the 458 win to 7mm Rem mag can be cut off and sized in the trim die, filed flat and then final trimmed to 1.790 in my Redding trimmer.

Not quite finished yet. Some kind of "delay" at PT&G on the reamer but Im making brass. BTW, once fired belted mag brass is pretty reasonable. I bought 300 for 75 dollars shipped. No need to look for the hard to come by 350 Remington mag brass, but I did come accross some. No need to pay for WSM or WSSM brass either. ;)

Case capacity in h2o is 58.7 grains. Basically a 358 Winchester....just shorter and fatter, with maybe a pinch more room and a smidgen more allowable chamber pressure *supposedly....going by the parent round but as in all wildcats, the end result CAN be different*. Time will tell but Im comfortable that this will do all I could want here for deer.

The 35 caliber rounds are all "thumpers" and the 358 Win has been and is being used on much larger game than our whitetails. I saw little to no reason to push the envelope on the biggest, baddest wildcat out there in a short 35 caliber wildcat.

Deer only take so much killin' and out to 200 yards when zeroed at 150.......there wont be any "hold over" going by even medium velocity loads and a decent bullet (via trajectory calculators Ive found fairly accurate over the years).

Energy wise the bullets will still carry way over the min for whitetail even at 300 yards and IMHO, there just isnt a lot of places I would feel comfortable, safety wise, shooting 300 yards in our home state and even the fastest of the wildcats legal in Indiana dont have much more than a couple inches less trajectory even at 300 yards. Shoot, I can count the number of times Ive had 300 yard shots on groundhogs on both hands.

With 99 percent of even possible shots in my area being 150-175 yards max, the self made and named "350 JR" will whack and stack any whitetail that walked.........and do it relatively inexpensively. The couple inches of flatter trajectory, or additional 50 yards of point blank range......just wasnt worth the cost ....TO ME. This will shoot so much flatter (and kick SO much less) than a 12 gauge slug, I'm good!

Kudos to those that feel differently. Aint a single thing wrong with wanting the fastest of them all......as long as you are willing and ABLE (not me!!) to pay the price to get there. I just went and followed my own path to reach a similar goal.

Besides........this was one HECK of a fun project and being a DIY one, I have to say there is some pride involved. Me thinks that alone was worth the cost! Sans the original cost of the rifle and factory dies, the gunsmith bill was 175 bucks.

God Bless
Steve

The 350 JR.....shown next to the parent round, the 350 Remington magnum.



 

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Love my 358 WSSM! Had two of them built on Savage actions. Just used mine to harvest an antlerless at 136 yards. Dropped in its tracks. Only bad thing is that I need to relieve myself of one of them. I had bought two so that my wife could have one, but the length of pull is too long and the heavy barrel that come on them is too heavy for her to comfortably hold for much time. I will be getting another built on a youth platform with a standard taper barrel, but that is going to cost me a little more.
 
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