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having read so many posts re: floating, "o" rings, glass bedding etc. I still seem to come back to a question. I'm no pro so don't throw things, please. I can see how you can fully bed a forend, but, it seems that all you can get with the ''O" ring thing is a kind of partial float, and that it would allow the forend to torque to either side due to the small contact area lying on a rubber ring? then again, full bedding to me (again non-pro), seems to simply increase the area for a hot bbl to push against to start going crazy. I've done no mods to my ultra forend so I can't say how my gun acts, but simply having consistent form on the bags seems to be my biggest ally in the accuracy dept. Sorry for being a bit wordy, just need the fog lifted :shock:
 

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Hello,
I have floated many handi forends and the trick to make it work is to keep the forend from binding between the barrel and receiver, the so-called O-ring trick will cause the forend to pitch down in the front because the contact point with the forend shoe and receiver is always the same position, when adding an o-ring or any thing else between the barrel and forend at the barrel lug point will cause the forend to be pitched down, as you tighten the attaching screw this causes the forend to try and level out causing a binding action between the foren, barrel, and action which will result in the barrel being pulled in one direction as it heats up when being fired.
The correct way to float the forend is to remove the forend from the gun and make sure the gun locks up tight without a forend on it. If the barrel does not lock up tight without a forend this problem must be fixed before continuing, once you have determined the gun locks up tight with out the forend remove the forend shoe from the rear of the forend and fill the screw holes with wooden dowels and 2-part epoxy, sand the barrel channel slightly oversized using a wooden dowel with a piece of sandpaper wrapped around it.
Next wrap a piece of electricians tape around the barrel at the points where the front and rear of the forend will contact the barrel, apply mold release, paste wax, light oil, etc. to the barrel lug and a small area around the barrel lug ( anything to keep epoxy from sticking to the metal ).
Apply a fair amount of 2-part epoxy to the flange area of the barrel lug and or to the forend attaching hole recessed area, install the forend onto the gun, attach the forend with the attaching screw and tighten the screw just snug, this will cause the epoxy to contact the wood and the barrel and also the tapered head of the screw will cause the barrel lug to align in the center of the hole in the forend, after the epoxy has set up remove the forend and make sure the epoxy has made a nice bed in the forend hole recessed area to allow only the barrel lug flange to contact the forend, if more epoxy is needed repeat the above procedure.
After it has been determined that you have a nice bedded area in the forend remove the tape from the barrel and install the forend, tighten the attaching screw and there should be a minor gap all the way around the barrel except where it is bedded against the lug flange, I like to have a gap about the size to slide a dollar bill between the barrel and forend.
The forend is now semi-floated which is the best you can do on the handi guns or any break open action type guns.
Next install the forend shoe onto the front of the action, slide the forend onto the lug and push into position, the forend should just barely touch the shoe, if it fits to tight remove the forend and sand the rear of the forend until it will easily fit into place.
Next remove the forend and the shoe, put a small amount of epoxy on the rear of the forend and press the shoe onto the forend and install the complete assembly onto the gun, tighten the attaching screw, wipe off any access epoxy from the shoe and forend and let the epoxy set up ( you should apply mold release to the bottom of the barrel above the shoe area to keep any epoxy from sticking to the barrel ). After the epoxy has set up remove the assembly and install the forend shoe attaching screws exactly in the center of the shoe holes. If you want to remove the shoe from the forend it will pop off very easily because the epoxy will not bond very well with the sick plastic.
You must understand the sole purpose of the forend is to give the shooter something to hang onto and with the shoe attached to the rear of the forend it will keep the barrel from falling off of the gun when it is broke open, the forend is not to be used to tighten the action by adding shims, if the gun will not lock up tight with out the forend them that is a whole other problem and should be corrected accordingly.
 

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You must understand the sole purpose of the forend is to give the shooter something to hang onto and with the shoe attached to the rear of the forend it will keep the barrel from falling off of the gun when it is broke open, the forend is not to be used to tighten the action by adding shims, if the gun will not lock up tight with out the forend them that is a whole other problem and should be corrected accordingly.
I'll agree with most of what you've said with this part being the most obvious wrong part....all one has to do is to look at the rifle to see...if the foerarm is 'binding a-little'...it will help take any play out of the breech end..and since the majority of NEF's have a minute amount of play there...having a shim behind the foreaem spacer isn't a detriment..but an aid in ensuring a complete lock up without any barrel moverment.If the forearm is tight...the barrel won't be able to shift as easy as if it were loose...The design of a 2 pc stock is as you say to give the shooter something to hold on to...and in a perfect world...having them loose may not be always the best...but..as we all know...the Handi's are far from being perfect..and if you want to experiment with different ways of making them shoot you should at least try it...

Fred M eliminated his movement in his barrel by using a steel bedding material on the rails of the reciever...and then bedded the forearm in a normal manner..This would be the most absolute way of being sure to take this variable out of it....All of this is dependent on just how much side to side movement the barrel has in the reciever....every Handi I have and currently own has had some with the forearm off....I've tried it both ways...and what i have found is the tigher the forearm is...the more accurate my rifles are...if they simply fall open..so do my groups...

It really doesn't take a-lot to try and see what works best ...and the on the plus side...anything that improves the shootability of the rifle is all that really matters.and this is one of the easier fixes....since each rifle is different...they may not respond to any 1 method of bedding...some may shoot better with a pressure point in the forearm channel...some may shoot better being fully bedded...on both sides of the barrel stud...or just in front...or just behind it....or just in the stud notch of the forearm...or truely fully bedded fore & aft...each rifle will respond differently...just as they do to different ammo...

Beckerhead...don't be afraid to try different things to get your Handi to shoot...with these great little rifles...it usually doesn't take a-lot to make them accurate...

Mac
 

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Beckerhead, I agree 100% with everything Mac has said, there isn't always just one way to make a Handi fulfill it's accuracy potential, any one of the techniques may work, or it may take a combination of changes. One thing that I've experience, is the shim between the spacer and forend is a real simple and inexpensive way to improve accuracy without a lot of work and changes to the forend that may not work, but without permanently dedicating that forend to that barrel, so barrel swapping is out of the question. I have several Handis and Ultras that all I did was add the spacer shim and sub moa accuracy was there with a load that was just mediocre to begin with!!

Tim
 

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Discussion Starter #5
thanks for the info. my current rifle is a solid 1" and less gun with all but Fed. ammo, so its not a concern. Im planning on a couple of new guns and wanted to be prepared for whatever. my biggest concern is a new superlight .243 cut to 16.5" I hope the shorter bbl will solve some of the pencil thin dancing Ive read about here. If not then I will now be prepared to bring to bear a flurry of shadetree gunsmithing tips. any superlight specific advice would be great too.
 

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Look in the FAQ, Perklo did some fantastic work with his...

Tim
 

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I use .004" thick aluminum furnace tape, it's easy to cut, sticks on but can be removed and is inexpensive to buy. It doesn't show at all if you trim it good, one thickness is usually all it takes, although I have used 2 layers on one forend to get the results I wanted.

Tim
 

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Same here...but a quick try to see if it will work is a buisness card...also you can try a couple thicknesses in front of the forearm screw to float the barrel...and up towards the front of the barrel channel for a pressure point...then find the furnace tape afterwards for a permanent shim...

Mac
 

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Wow!

I learn more everyday I come here.
Don't get me wrong my handi rifles shoot good, but I try and get as much out of them as I can. Just so you guys understand I like tinkering, just ask my dad. When I was 6 yrs old I took all his wind up clocks (4 of them) apart one day while the baby sitter was half asleep. Boy was he mad! We can laugh about it now though :-D

Norse
 
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