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I always laugh when I see "Obamacare" touted as "government" insurance. The only "government" insurance there is in this country is Medicare and Medicaid. If you are not on one of those (or if you have a Medicare supplemental/advantage) you have PRIVATE INSURANCE. Those rates have been going up at a phenomenal rate for the last 20-30 years. The one thing "Obamacare" did do is eliminate "fake" insurance that really didn't cover much, but was cheap. You thought you had coverage, until you got sick. Sort of like the woman mentioned that had an airlift that wasn't covered, they told her AFTER, she wasn't covered and owed $50K. Catastrophic care insurance is fine IF you can pay out of pocket for the differential. I have a friend who for years only carried a plan that picked up at about $25-50K of medical expense. His (own) company paid all medical up to that limit. Fortunately he (the company) could afford those kind of expenses when they arrived. Most can not. Many many years ago when I lived in California you did NOT need to carry liability insurance; BUT if you were in an accident you had to immediately post a bond for about the amount of a new car (at the time). Most people can not do that. What I would like to see is BOTH parties working TOGETHER to come up with something better then we had/have. Short of that the Republicans should just repeal the ACA in total and then live with the results; it is "what the people wanted".
 

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NW it caused our friend to have to file for bankruptcy. Just to keep her home, then their were hospital expenses that Obamacare didn't mention even in her handbook. For a hysterectomy? It isn't just the insurance that's becoming rediculous it's also the medical cost. She said she would have gotten better care going to a
veterinarian.
 

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It looks like the republicans have probably botched the Obamacare repeal and replace. If they don't get this done right, I'm done with voting republican. It will be all democrats all the way every election for the rest of my life.


That includes voting only for democrat candidates, which implies supporting their platform issues like banning guns etc.


These republican slackers can't do anything.


I've had it, and I just can't support these imbeciles anymore.
that you would make your choice on ONE ISSUE, makes me wonder if you were ever a supporter of the Republicans.

health care is only ONE issue, and not the one to do the most harm to the USA.

CAGW, Carbon scams and the continuing migration of muslims into the USA are a far greater risk. Carbon scams in the near future bankrupting you, and Islam in the distant future destroying you.

I might even vote for Hillary in her 2032 run for the presidency.

now I TOTALLY KNOW you've lost your mind!
Bad homebrew?
 

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that you would make your choice on ONE ISSUE, makes me wonder if you were ever a supporter of the Republicans.

health care is only ONE issue, and not the one to do the most harm to the USA.

CAGW, Carbon scams and the continuing migration of muslims into the USA are a far greater risk. Carbon scams in the near future bankrupting you, and Islam in the distant future destroying you.
What you say is true no doubt. But Conan is just as fed up with Congress as the rest of us are. He will come
out of it give him some time.
 

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It looks like the republicans have probably botched the Obamacare repeal and replace. If they don't get this done right, I'm done with voting republican. It will be all democrats all the way every election for the rest of my life.


That includes voting only for democrat candidates, which implies supporting their platform issues like banning guns etc.


These republican slackers can't do anything.


I've had it, and I just can't support these imbeciles anymore.
Only a fool would cut off his own nose to spite someone else.
 

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Neither of these parties is acting in the public's interest. They represent only self serving special interests. Washington, D.C. has become a parliament of whores. If there were any honesty in our government they would be required to hang a red lantern above the entrance of both the White House and Congress to warn they public about what goes on inside.
 

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Neither the Republicans or Democrats are capable of creating a national health care program worthy of this great nation. Instead they kowtow to the extremists of both the radical left and the reactionary right. We are the ONLY modern industrialized nation that does not have a functioning national health care program. Every effort is thwarted by the interests of the medical community, the drug companies, the insurance companies. Not unexpected as they are the ones that finance both parties,
 

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it wasn't that long ago that Canada's Illness Management System was more expensive per capita than the US insurance schemes.

under ACA, that is no longer so

our system in Canada will bankrupt is eventually, as there is no will or way to control costs in a public system.
Well, there is ONE way, but there is no political will for it.

that "way" is to have the costs follow the patient
 

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Well Conan, looks like you have your way. Trump is forcing a show down today. Repeal it, or it stays, and he's done with it. Just hope they did it right. Their going to have to do a fancy dance with this, so many millions to cover that don't add anything to the system. The payload in this health care elevator is way over weight, and the whole health care system needs an overhaul. Tort reform on lawsuits, drug company's overcharging, hospital costs so high because they're charging the people with insurance to off set the ones that don't/can't have insurance. Good luck with this mess!! gypsyman
 

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Imo, fwiw,

the GOP is, in reality, only a bit better than the dems.

the GOP tends to be a bit more moral than dems...IMO, the dems stand for nothing but shame, misery, confusion and immorality. with stalwarts like Schummer, Pelosi, Reid, Durbin, Clinton, and BO...they stand for nothing else...they replace one abomination, Boxer, with an equally, if not worse "representative" with Kamala Harris...:tango_face_surprise:tango_face_sad:
 

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Well Conan, looks like you have your way. Trump is forcing a show down today. Repeal it, or it stays, and he's done with it. Just hope they did it right. Their going to have to do a fancy dance with this, so many millions to cover that don't add anything to the system. The payload in this health care elevator is way over weight, and the whole health care system needs an overhaul. Tort reform on lawsuits, drug company's overcharging, hospital costs so high because they're charging the people with insurance to off set the ones that don't/can't have insurance. Good luck with this mess!! gypsyman
Well they did rename it, now it's the American health care act. :rolleyes: Whoo Hoo don't get to excited Conan.
 

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Discussion Starter #72
On the one hand, I am glad to see this process is the "sausage making" of true political process. There is argument, deal making, debate, concession, intractability, and all that good stuff. That's a very good thing. Much better than the sub rosa manner in which obamacare was shoved down our throats by mechanism of back room deals that were out of the public eye.


I also don't know what's really going on. I've read about the "trump no longer negotiating" headlines. I am not sure what it all means. But I can say this: If the republicans fail on this, they own the consequences, and those consequences will be heavy. If they don't act to repeal and replace, then they will forever own obamacare and all the bad stuff in it, and the democrats will be total off the hook in terms of responsibility in the public eye. Republicans have this one once-in-a-generation opportunity to do something right, and we shall see what they do with that opportunity. Past performance does predict future results in cases of human behavior, so I am very very pessimistic about what to expect from those dolts.
 

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Discussion Starter #73
Well Conan, looks like you have your way. Trump is forcing a show down today. Repeal it, or it stays, and he's done with it. Just hope they did it right. Their going to have to do a fancy dance with this, so many millions to cover that don't add anything to the system. The payload in this health care elevator is way over weight, and the whole health care system needs an overhaul. Tort reform on lawsuits, drug company's overcharging, hospital costs so high because they're charging the people with insurance to off set the ones that don't/can't have insurance. Good luck with this mess!! gypsyman

All this is so infuriating. They have to get this right. I may not go democrat all the way, but I sure as heck will be working to vote some republicans out of office.
 

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Well guys, it doesn't matter anymore. That Bill is dead, Trump told Ryan to pull it. On to the next item. Let's hope the tax reform has a better outcome.
 

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might as well turn in your guns while your at it. The bill failed so it looks like you might want to take up golf!
It looks like the republicans have probably botched the Obamacare repeal and replace. If they don't get this done right, I'm done with voting republican. It will be all democrats all the way every election for the rest of my life.


That includes voting only for democrat candidates, which implies supporting their platform issues like banning guns etc.


These republican slackers can't do anything.


I've had it, and I just can't support these imbeciles anymore.
 

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This was Ryan's debacle. Every president winds up going through a few leaders before finding the right people.

The bill sucked. Ryan drafted it without input from the Freedom Caucus. Thats the real story.
 

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It was a mess. No need to replace one mess with another just to say you did something.

Ryan is a total dud. Just another politician enjoying all the perks they have voted for themselves and really cares nothing for the country.
 

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It was a mess. No need to replace one mess with another just to say you did something.

Ryan is a total dud. Just another politician enjoying all the perks they have voted for themselves and really cares nothing for the country.
Up there trying to look like they are doing they're phony baloney jobs.
 
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