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Discussion Starter #1
I have a stainless sidekick that I've recently scoped with a 2x7 Nikon and I've also done a .25 ACP conversion to it.

Next week's trip to the range will be the first real break-in of this firearm in preparation for Michigan's muzzleloading season.

I will be using loose 777 ffg and I have a supply of 250 gr. T/C Shockwaves, 250 gr. Barnes MZ Expanders and 285 gr. Barnes MZ Spitfires to start with.

I can't seem to get my hands on any ML ballistics, so I'm somewhat unclear what kind of velocitiy/energy to expect with any of these projectiles using varying amounts of powder. Real life hunting distances are 50 - 100 yds.

I know I need to try them all to see what patterns the best, but
what would be the minimum amount of powder needed to achieve enough knock down/stay down power out to 100 yds?

I've read that the Barnes MZ Spitfires need around 1400 fps to initiate expansion as compared to 1100 fps for the Barnes MZ Expanders.
So one of my concerns is that an adequate amount of powder would be employed if using the Spitfires out to 100 yds.

Any help that you can pass along is appreciated.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Tim you truly are Quick.
It's amazing how you have some of these things at your finger tips.
Really appreciate it

I'm having difficulty trying to interpret some of this data.
A question or two if you don't mind.

Looking at the 250 gr MZ table:

Column 2 777 pellets is comparatively less than Column 4 which I'm assuming is loose 777.
I understand pellets are prox. 85% of equivalent loose powder so this makes sense.
But there's a considerable increase in velocity from 90 gr to 100 gr pellets (1629fps to 1861 fps = +239 fps)
as compared to 100 gr. to 120 gr. pellets (1861 fps to 1884 fps = +23fps)
Just doesn't seem right if I'm reading it correctly.

Why wouldn't there be any data for 110 gr pellets?
 

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I'll let someone else take a crack at that, I've never used pellets, but it doesn't make much sense, does it, perhaps a call or email to Barnes would be in order??

1-800-574-9200 or email [email protected]

Tim
 

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I use 85gr. of T7, and with a 250gr. xtp killed a deer at about 150-60yds. two years ago. From everything I've read and figured, I'm getting around 1700-1800fps with a 250gr. bullet(closer to the higher), and that is using 85gr. I would say that you could get down to 70ish grains, and as long as you place your shots you would be good within a 100yd. or a bit further.

~Amos
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I'll see how everything patterns at 90 grains to start with.

That should be plenty for the 250 gr. sabots.

I'll then see how the 285 gr. Barnes Spitfires perform with 95 and 100 grains.

Thanks for your help.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I took Quick's suggestion and emailed Barnes.
I received a reply the following day and found the information very helpful.
This is the reply I received:


"Let me address the expansion velocities first.
All of the muzzleloader bullets Barnes makes require a minimum impact velocity of 1100fps for expansion
with the exception of the 250gr MZ Expander which requires a minimum impact velocity of 1050fps.

Now to address the pellet issue:
We found the 30 grain pellets we tested to be slightly less potent than the 50gr pellets and the data reflects this.
We chose not to mix the two and that is why you don't see a load listed for 110gr pellet charge.

Thanks for the great questions."

Ty[/color]

So as I read it, the table reflects combinations of 30 or 50 grain pellets but not 30 and 50 grain pellets.

http://www.barnesbullets.com/images/MuzzleloaderData.pdf[/color]

Thanks Ty!
 
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