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I spoke to a TC phone representative today about the maximum load to use in a TC Hawken of triple seven. She said TC does not recommend Triple 7 use in the TC hawken rife at all and then said they do recommend the use of blackthorn 209 in the TC Hawken. After I questioned both of her recommendations three times she put me on hold to check with another representative and she came back and said she was correct. I insisted she check with someone else because of her recommendation on blackthorn 209 being safe because of everything I have read indicated it was unsafe and triple 7 was safe to use. I was put on hold for 5 minutes and she came back with the both are not recommended in a TC Hawken.

It never have heard that triple seven Was not recommended or unsafe to use. I have read online that use of triple 7 should be used with a reduction of 15% by volume due to it being 15% more powerful than BP or Pyrodex. Any advice would be helpful. Thank you.
 

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I would just stick to real black powder or maybe Pyrodex in that gun, but I do know for a fact that guys use 777 in Hawkens. BH209 is a fantastic powder, but I wouldn't try it with a cap gun, needs a hot ignition.
 

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BH209 requires 209 primers which cannot be discussed in this forum, see the sticky on what can and cannot be discussed here.

Tim
 

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BH209 requires 209 primers which cannot be discussed in this forum, see the sticky on what can and cannot be discussed here.

Tim
Well you're the one who brought it up...:rolleyes:
 

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Well apparently there is no one at Smith & Center that knows anything about the old BP guns. 777 performs just find in sidehammers. The 777 formula is BP load-15%=777 load. I use 75 grains FFg 777 in my Renegade with Remington #10 caps.
 

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BH209 requires 209 primers which cannot be discussed in this forum, see the sticky on what can and cannot be discussed here.

Tim
Just wondering why the means of ignition is off limits but all the BP subs used in a traditional side lock is ok ? By the way my side locks wear scopes aside from verniers (used for target) and I"m pretty sure my use of primers instead of percussion caps is based in some history predating 777/and all the other subs . Try shooting under hammers while not wearing sleeves or watch blow back with the accompanying shrapnel aside from nobody carries #11 caps in many areas . But rules are rules and I wont be breaking any more or helping the OP to get better results / I"m done
 

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I never did see any logic to using anything but black powder in a black powder gun, other than the substitute powder pyrodex in the odd guns that just won't accurately shoot with real black powder. The older guns had the following engraved on the barrels:

BLACK POWDER ONLY..... or some had BLACK POWDER OR PYRODEX ONLY
 

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Just wondering why the means of ignition is off limits but all the BP subs used in a traditional side lock is ok ? By the way my side locks wear scopes aside from verniers (used for target) and I"m pretty sure my use of primers instead of percussion caps is based in some history predating 777/and all the other subs . Try shooting under hammers while not wearing sleeves or watch blow back with the accompanying shrapnel aside from nobody carries #11 caps in many areas . But rules are rules and I wont be breaking any more or helping the OP to get better results / I"m done
Well, the forum is TRADITIONAL Muzzle Loading Rifles and Shotguns, if the powder can be shot in that category I would guess that it fits! Using a rifle/shotgun with modern ignition does not... Pretty simple. If you think this forum is strict, try posting that stuff on a dedicated BP forum! FYI, they allow BP subs as well...
 

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So adding a Variflame adapter would make my Renegade a modern muzzleloader? Bet the frizzen pan boys thought the same way when they came up with those nasty caps!
 

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So adding a Variflame adapter would make my Renegade a modern muzzleloader? Bet the frizzen pan boys thought the same way when they came up with those nasty caps!
Sure would! And I still think that way of those cap guys...
 

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Baloney. :)
 

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I ran some "Shockey's Gold" FFF in a .32 Cherokee for a youth shoot. It was only about 17 grains so the little kids could shoot it comfortably. I had no misfires or malfunctions all day (about 6 hours of continuous shooting). And clean-up took me less than an hour. I bought more to run in my .50 Hawken from now on. I'm DONE with traditional black powder.
 

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Only real Black for me, and my clean up takes 15 minutes or less....
 
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I shoot 80 grains of T7 in my TC Hawkins 50 cal and my TC plains Rifle side lock. I just make sure I tip the rifle to the right to have powder drop in the flame channel.

I do not use real black because it is not sold local to many restructions on storeing it. I also do not like the Idea of paying a extra hasmat fee on top of already high shipping cost.

Al
 

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If you're bent and determinned to use that BH powder, CCI makes a magnum #11 cap that might work out. I have a side lock that needs a #11 magnum cap to avoid hangfires when using Pyrodex, it fires FFFG great, no problem, except it's just an odd ball that won't accurately shoot BP.
 

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Good point alleyyooper! The only shop that carries genuine black powder is a half an hour drive for me. You go in and ask for it and they go to an outside building to get it for you.
 
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