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Was wondering what factory ammo everyone uses. I've tried remington umc 45gr. hp. and could not get a grouping at 200 yards. (When I say could not get a grouping I mean under 2 inches). at 100 I held less than an inch. With winchester I hold a little better grouping at 100 and at 200 1.25in. grouping. Same 45 gr. hp. At 100 yards the remington shoot almost 2.5 in. higher than winchester. Havn't tried any other brands yet since the winchester seem to be very consistant. Was just wondering what others shoot.
 

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Welcome to the forum. I am sure you will learn a lot here and there are some great guys here as well.
The Winchester White Box 45gr JHP are about the best thing most of us here shoot through our 223 Handi's. Many try and try to get some hand loads to match these with out sucess. As for cheap ammo-mine likes the UMC's (55gr FMJ's) better than the Winchester White Box 55gr FMJ's. But still I keep going back to those WWB 45gr.
 

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Handi .223 Ammo

I can emphatically confirm that Winchester White Box .223 Varmint 45 gr's is the best I have shot thru my Handi--------great stuff( 4 three shot groups averaged 0.83 inches). I've tried ALLOT of reloads with spotty success (slower and less accurate than White Box and at the same cost to me). Someone PLEASE tell me what powder Winchester is using.

McL
 

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In addition to Winchester White Box, I've found the Ultramax also shoots very well; both their 40 and 50gr Nosler BT's.

While it's not really any cheaper to reload the .223, I've been able to duplicate the performance using Varget and 50gr Nosler BT's. I've found that 26 grains is a "sweet spot" for my Ultra, but haven't tried using more as of yet. Some loads call for up to 27 or 27.5 grains, so I may try increasing it in the future and see what happens.

Good luck! 8)
 

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There is no magic bullet that shoots well in all of them. You are going to have to experiment. Some have good success with the 55gr UMC and the 45gr WW , but my NEF shoots the UMC into 2" groups, the WW into 1" groups and 40gr VMax/H335 reloads into 1/2" groups.
 

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Hello and welcome phoneman,

I reload all my ammo, but as far as factory ammo goes Winchester White Box 45gr JHP works the best in my .223 ultra.


Norse
 

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The winchester white box 40 round value 45 gr. Hp. shoot well in my 223. And you might want to try some UMC 55 gr. FMJ. Both can be had at Wal-mart. The win. are around $14 and the UMC are around $4.
 

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Try the 52 grain hollow points from ultramax. they work extremely well and shoot well under what the UMC's, WWB 45's, American Eagle's, or the Wolf ammo. Like I said it worked for me.
 

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The bad news is you are going to have to spend a lot of time at the range with a bunch of great people, trying a lot of different ammo. Oh wait, thats the good news. There is no bad news.
 

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What's the Twist in your barrels ?
.223
~~~
1+9 ( Likes heavier bullets over 55 gr and up )
1+12 ( Likes 55 or lower )
1+14 ( Likes 55 0r lower )

The last .223 HR I checked was a 1+9 twist
 

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Per H&R, they have a 1:12" twist rate. H&R/NEF .223 Rems are notorious for not shooting the heavier bullets weights, mainly blamed on the slower for a .223 twist rate, but it could also be due to bores that are slightly on the large side of spec.... My Ultra has a 1:12" twist, FWIW, shoots the 45gr JHP WWB less than moa consistently.

Tim
 

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I too have found the WW white box 45 JHP to be the most accurate factory loaded round in my Handi 223. I don't ususally shoot factory ammo except to zero a scope or for bore foulers after cleaning. As far as twist... I have a Savage 223 with a 9" twist that consistantly shoots 52 grain Bergers under 1/2" for 5 shots. But the best I have done with my Handi 223 is about 3/4". Once in a while I will get a group at about 1/2".
 

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Here's a little study that deals with TWIST ......... it's all interesting even though ones personal experience can be different. Many new shooters don't know about barrel twist vs bullet weight.
______________________________

223 BARREL TWIST vs. ACCURACY
Does the standard 55 gr. ammo perform well in fast 1-to-9 twist barrels? Our M-16 Tells the story



For the decades, the 5,56 mm NATO (.223) cartridge consisted of 55 gr. projectile fired out of barrels with a slow 1-in-12 inch twist. Lately, in attempt to gain more range , the trend has been to switch to heavier 62 gr. projectiles. To stabilize the heavier bullets, the rifles have been issued barrels with a quicker 1-in-9 or 1-in-7 inch twist.

While the 1-in-12 inch barrel can't stabilize the heavier 62 gr. bullet. We have been told the 1-in-9 inch tube will work quite well with either the newer 62 or older 55 gr. projectile.

The most popular rifle to find out with is the AR-15/M-16 series. Several years ago, Colt discontinued their old style A1 rifles which had the 1-in-12 twist barrels, and created the A2 series with the faster 1-in-9 tube.

Afterwards, the national gun publications kept telling us how accurate the new models were, even when firing the lighter 55 gr. cartridges. Problem is, this does not agree with numerous AR-15/M-16 shooters I have talked to, who claim accuracy with heavy .223 bullets, but lousy groups when shooting lighter projectiles out of their newer 1-in-9 barrels.

THE TEST

To find out what was true, and what was hype, I decided to conduct my own test.

For the performance and accuracy evaluation, we purchase the following .223 ammunition.

PMC 55 gr. ball
IMI Samson 55 gr. hollow points
Winchester Super -X 55 gr. soft points
PMC 64 gr. soft points
JSC Barnaul (Russian) 62 gr. ball
For the best accuracy results, all shooting was conducted within military spec "sight in" guidelines. This involved placing a 250 meter simulator target 25 yards away. This procedure eliminates light distortion and windage problems, which were very present in the hot Arizona desert we were shooting in. The 5-shot groups (I consider that three shot groups are not precise enough) would be multiplied by 4 to get the equivalent 100 yard group, or minute of angle (MOA).

TEST #1

First we fired AR-15 with 20-inch 1-in-12 inch barrel. Our PMC 55 gr. ball showed a 3,4 inch MOA. Second, the Winchester 55 gr. did 2.5 MOA. Third, IMI H.P. gave a 5-shot group reading 2.5 MOA. This is an average of 2.8 MOA overall.

Next, we conducted the same firing sequence with our M-16 rifle. We got 4.5 MOA with PMC ball, which this particular rifle never liked anyway. Then 3.0 with Winchester SP, and 3.0 using IMI HP rounds. The overall reading was 3.5 MOA. Finally, the Colt Carbine with 1-in-9 barrel was fired. It showed 4.4 MOA with PMC ball, 4.0 for Winchester SP, and 5.0 with IMI HP. Overall average was 4.5 MOA.

Time for some different ammo!

TEST #2

Since the heavier 62 and 64 gr. bullets will not stabilize in 1-in-12 barrels, the only rifle used for this last test was the Colt A2 rifle with 1-in-9 tube.

First, we shot the PMC 64 gr. soft-point ammunition. What a difference! The initial firing sequence gave us an MOA reading of 3 MOA, and next was a 2.5 MOA for 2.75 overall.

Next, on out list was the Russian 62 gr. ball made by the JSC Barnaul Machine Tool Plant. This stuff came into the market just recently, and was selling for only $135 per thousand rounds as May 1999. Is it any good, you ask? Seeing how we obtained consistent 2-inch MOA groups, with some bullets going through the same hole on the target, I would say very much so! JCS also makes 55 gr. 5.56 mm ammo, but I could not find any for this test.

CONCLUSION

After I did this test, I discussed the results with many target shooters who use the AR-15 and M-16 system. he stories I heard were the same: Fast twist 1-in-9 and 1-in-7 barrels work fine with heavy bullets, but lose about 20-30% accuracy when using the standard 55 gr. projectiles, which were designed for slower 1-in-12 type. In spite of this many shooters use the lighter 55 gr. anyway because it's much cheaper to buy , and more available. But if the 62 gr. JSC Russian ammo works as good in other rifles as did in mine, and continues to sell this cheap, this should no longer be an issue. In any case, those who are not getting acceptable accuracy from their A2 "fast twist" barrels have a clear choice: use heavier bullets or change the barrel.
 

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My .223 did not like the Rem. UMC Ammo at all. Black hills remanufactured ammo (55 gr) was marginal. The 45gr jhp Winchester has worked best so far.
 

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RipOne said:
What's the Twist in your barrels ?
.223
~~~
1+9 ( Likes heavier bullets over 55 gr and up )
1+12 ( Likes 55 or lower )
1+14 ( Likes 55 0r lower )

The last .223 HR I checked was a 1+9 twist
Rip, where did you find a Handi with a 1 in 9 twist? As far as I know, they all have 1 in 12 twists. I'd like to have one with a 1 in 9 twist though.

Was wondering what factory ammo everyone uses.
My Ultra is pretty typical in that it also likes the Winchester white box 45 grain HP's. There is a guy locally who sells "remanufactured" ammo under the name Rafter 7. He has a load with a 52 grain HP that also shoots real well in my Ultra. I think it's a 52 grain Sierra BTHP bullet, and I don't know what powder. It's in LC cases.

Most of the time, a 1 in 12 twist is going to favor the lighter bullets due to their shorter length. The weight of the bullet really doesn't have anything to do with it. It's the length of the bullet that determines the degree of stabalization of the bullet.
 

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WIscott: That rifle was brought to me 2 years ago saying it wouldn't group / well ......... we all know that the potential problem list is long, but he was shooting light weight 42 or so ,,,,,,,,, called factory with rifle details and they identified as 1-9 Twist ........... we went to 63 gr for the fix.

Increased bullet weight equals longer bullet length / I believe weigh & length together have to do with stabilizing,but I'm getting so old that I do things like leave my truck idling in the driveway all night :)
 
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