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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I grew up with guns, but in the city kid kind of way. Small guns, mouse guns as they are called now, the small pocket pistols for the sole use of self defense. Little .22's, .25's, the occasional .32acp in something like a war souvenir Walther PP or PPK, or Mauser HSc. Still compact but with enough weight to soak up enough recoil that they were actually pleasant guns to shoot. In other language, the .380 used to be a mid size compact coat pocket size gun. If your coat had big pockets.

Recent events has made me stop and rethink my EDC carry gun. For over thirty years I've been a fan of the tiny North American Arms mini .22 revivers. One has been in my pocket for a very long time and a very large amount of miles. It's been a backpacking gun, my fishing gun, my dinner out with my wife of over 4 decades gun, my take the grandkids to the zoo gun, canoe on the Potomac river gun, and many other uses. For the close range role of self defense at bad breath range which is where most assault take place, it's been fine.

But the amount of mass shootings has to me, put a new dynamic on self defense. My little derringer size mini revolvers are fine for an attempted car jacking like I had just after dawn on Sunday morning Memorial Day weekend of 2017. In the close confines of a rest room on interstate 10 by Ft. Hancock Texas, it was fine. But for the longer range, of say the house wares isle at Walmart, it may be a bit inadequate.

So, I bought a Ruger LCP.

I've been to the range now twice with the LCP, and put a white box of 100 rounds of Winchester each time. I can shoot it just fine, on a half size B29 silhouette at 7 yards I can keep them where it's gonna hurt. Some in the 10 ring, some in the 8 and 9 ring, a few I'm not proud of. Bill Jordan I ain't.

But the thing I wonder about is, how long with I be able to to that? I'm 68 years old, have some ostio arthritis issues in my hands due to 30 years of cranking on Bridgeport mills and Hardinge lathes for a living. My Doctor has x-rayed my hands and the base joints of both thumbs and smoother joints on index fingers and elsewhere have issues. He says it's normal for a guy maybe and ex-profession and just take some ibuprofen or the meds he prescribed. He's at the VA hospital in Austin where I get my health care, so the meds are free.

The gun is snappy, not near as bad as the aluminum frame air weight S&W 637 I sold. That thing killed my hand after had a 50 round box, yet I can shoot 100 rounds of the .38o with some minor pain. But enough pain that the next day my hands are still bit sore. Pain on flexing o the fingers and difficulty in small jobs like doing things for my granddaughter out in the work shop. I can see I a few years I will not be able to handle the snappy little LCP. It's even hard to rack the slide after several mags of ammo through it fairly rapidly.

I guess I'm reminiscing about all the little .25's that have come and gone, like the little Baur .25 that was pleasant to shoot. The Beretta .25 jet fire I fall down a lot from kicking myself in the butt for selling it. Also a fun gun to shoot. These new age polymer pocket size .380's are not the nice guns to shoot that the old PP and PPK's and Colt pocket models were. I miss the little .25's. Yes, they make a .380 the size of the old .25's, but is that a good thing?

I'm wondering if I have come to some sort of crossroads, or enlightenment, where I release that if I don't carry a tiny mouse gun, then just bite the bullet and get a good carry rig for a full size gun like a Glock 19 or equivalent?

The idea of a compact .380 thats big enough to be comfortable to shoot seems self defeating. If I'm going to wear a holster to conceal a .380, then why not just go for a 9mm?

Tiny truly pocket size mouse gun or near full size gun in high ride pancake rig. The in-between stuff seems to be an awkward solution to a problem.
 

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the LCP i got needed a couple of hundred rounds put through
it before it "settled down" and would shoot half decent.
do i care for a .380 ? not at all, but sometimes you have to make
do with what you have or can get. i know i can get someone off
of me for sure and make them lose interest in beating my head in.
 

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Might have your solution. I, too, am a 68yr old arthritis riddled wreck, who pretty much has the same complaints.

My wife found a Sig Sauer p365, and we discovered the 10 rd 9mm recoils lighter than her Glock 42 which is a .380 with less capacity than the 365. It's compact, heavy for it's size, accurate to 15 yds with about anything we tried feeding it, and we're still waiting for any malfunction.....it is soooo dependable!

Of course there has to be a drawback. The magazines are difficult to load without a loader assisting device, so carry a back up magazine, the housewares aisle in Wallyworld isn't friendly to reloading a magazine in a gunfight anyway. The other is holsters for CCW are pretty much limited to IWB, or a Sneaky Pete.

Racking the slide is a problem for a lot of women who carry concealed. That was a major selling point for Elaine when the p365 wasn't a problem.

Like I said, we share some concerns, and once I tried it on the range and it didn't hurt to shoot it, we bought a second one for my carry gun, picked up the Sneaky Pete I mentioned, and placed MY NAA 22 magnum mini revolver in my gun safe.(Ironically I also carried one):tango_face_smile:

This could be worth it for you to look into cb51. Hope this helps.:)
 

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You could also look into a .32 ACP like the Beretta Tomcat, KelTec .32, Seecamp, maybe a couple others. Taurus makes a .380 revolver. Ruger makes their LC in .380 (same size as the 9mm version).

Also there's a few .327 Federal revolvers, and you could load it with .32 H&R magnums for less recoil.
 

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Given that option I would go full size. If you are concerned about being caught up in a mass shooting situation and want adequate firepower then go full sized. The smallest 380 I own and carry is a Pk380 and I bring a spare mag with me. The Pk is pleasant 380 to shoot but also pretty good sized while being easily concealable but still, if you are thinking beyond 10 yards or multiple, possibly armored assailants then I would go with at least a 9mm unless you are skilled enough to close the distance and use a 380 effectively. imo
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Given that option I would go full size. If you are concerned about being caught up in a mass shooting situation and want adequate firepower then go full sized. The smallest 380 I own and carry is a Pk380 and I bring a spare mag with me. The Pk is pleasant 380 to shoot but also pretty good sized while being easily concealable but still, if you are thinking beyond 10 yards or multiple, possibly armored assailants then I would go with at least a 9mm unless you are skilled enough to close the distance and use a 380 effectively. imo

That's about where I'm coming to.

I tried the true pocket size .380 and .38 special air weights and they were just a PITA to shoot. Not even that shootable. When we first moved to Texas and the better half and I took the course and shot to qualify, we used a plain old rental Glock 17 and shot a perfect score. Easy, light recall, accurate. I'm thinking if I really need more than a pocket pistol, then why not just go for a full size Glock or S&W Shield?

With a good high ride pancake holster holding the gun high and tight to my body, and a good thick belt, it shouldn't be too hard to get used to. I'm having a lack of faith for the mid size and compact .380's and 9mm's. If I can carry a Glcok 26, what not just go Glock 19 or 3ven 17 and have a better shooting gun? If Ihave to carry a mid size .380 to get a good shooter, why fool around with LCP and Keltech, and go for the PP or PPK?

I know I shoot good with a full size Glock, and I loved the old 1911 we had when I was in the army. But I'm getting very disenchanted with these little pocket .380's.
 

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I bought a Sig Sauer 238 in 380 caliber and I love it and wouldn't trade it for a half dozen LCP pistols if I had to shoot them. I say this because of their nasty recoil. I know how they recoil from shooting my son's LCP, which BTW, left me bleeding from the pocket clip digging into my hand. Lifes too short to subject myself to that kind of abuse.
 

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I Cary either a sigP238 or a Kimber micro 380. Both shoot good, are concealable, and don’t hurt to shoot them,and most important I can rack their slides without any problem.
 

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I would imagine if you are able to fire off a few rounds before it becomes an issue, when the adrenaline is rushing, you won't feel any pain until may be the next day.


The LCP is to protect me up close and personal. In a mass shooting situation, I will attempt to retreat to the vehicle and get something with much more fire power if possible.


You guys are right, that little gun does have some kick to it. Anytime you go light, recoil is going to go up.


Has anyone tried the S&W EZ380? It is specifically designed for weak and or arthritic hands. Easier to rack etc. Might be a good option??



Rosewood
 

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Discussion Starter #12
I bought a Sig Sauer 238 in 380 caliber and I love it and wouldn't trade it for a half dozen LCP pistols if I had to shoot them. I say this because of their nasty recoil. I know how they recoil from shooting my son's LCP, which BTW, left me bleeding from the pocket clip digging into my hand. Lifes too short to subject myself to that kind of abuse.
??????

What pocket clip?
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I would imagine if you are able to fire off a few rounds before it becomes an issue, when the adrenaline is rushing, you won't feel any pain until may be the next day.


The LCP is to protect me up close and personal. In a mass shooting situation, I will attempt to retreat to the vehicle and get something with much more fire power if possible.


You guys are right, that little gun does have some kick to it. Anytime you go light, recoil is going to go up.


Has anyone tried the S&W EZ380? It is specifically designed for weak and or arthritic hands. Easier to rack etc. Might be a good option??



Rosewood
Yeah Rosewood, I looked at the EZ380. Too big.

The outright compactness of the LCP is what drew me to it to start with. I wanted a true pocket pistol that was to carry as my old North American Arms mini .22's, but with more oomph. And you're right; more power in a small package means more recoil and a nastier little gun to shoot.

Living in Georgetown Texas, its hot in summer. Wardrobe usually consists of t-shirt or Magellan fishing shirt, shorts, and Keen sandals. Summer time temps are in the 100 degree range and wearing cover garments is not really feasible, and I don't like open carry. I had a Glock 26 for two and a half years and carried it twice. Just too bulky, and didn't shoot near as nice as the full size 17. Grip was way to short and fat.

So that's why I'm at this cross roads of second guessing myself. Big gun and good carry rig, or subcompact and just put up with an unpleasant gun to shoot. If I need a plinker to shoot 200 rounds through in an afternoon, I have my S&W 63 and Marlin 39. My thoughts echo around if on unhand I do away with the LCP, why not just go with a Glock 17 or 19 in a good pancake rig. On the other hand, the LCP fits in my pocket almost like it's not there and it gives me greater range and oomph than my tiny derringer class mini revolver.

Thats what I love about forums; it gives different perspectives on things, and you guys have been great as a sounding board for my own jumbled thoughts. I know I'm not the brightest bulb in the chandelier, so I have to, at times mull things over a great deal. To stir the pot and see what comes up.
 

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I packed the NAA 22 mag for about 20 years. Graduated to the LCP a few years back. I also recently bought a couple of the light "travelers" vest. They are quite nice, even in hot weather. I find they are cooler when in direct sunlight because they keep the heat off you and they cover about any side pistol you want to carry OWB. Good for storing your cell phone, sunglasses and anything else you want also.



Rosewood
 

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If you are willing to consider something the size of a S&W 642 then you might want to check out a CZ82 in 9x18 or the CZ83 in 380acp.

My CZ82 is a 12+1 and is, to me, quite comfortable to shoot.
I would carry it if I had a good holster for it. I think that

https://www.craftholsters.com
makes nice holsters to fit most guns. I like the model 131 crossdraw, I just can't afford it.
 

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Discussion Starter #16 (Edited)
If you are willing to consider something the size of a S&W 642 then you might want to check out a CZ82 in 9x18 or the CZ83 in 380acp.

My CZ82 is a 12+1 and is, to me, quite comfortable to shoot.
I would carry it if I had a good holster for it. I think that

https://www.craftholsters.com
makes nice holsters to fit most guns. I like the model 131 crossdraw, I just can't afford it.
Too big and heavy. If I go to a gun that needs a holster, then I'm going to a Glock 17 or maybe a 19. I'm very impressed with Glocks in general. My whole goal in going with a sub compact .380 was to have a gun that was truly small enough to fit in my Wrangler shorts pocket so it would ALWAYS be on me, much like my little NAA mini revolvers were. But with more range and power. I've lost interest in the mid size guns, as they make no sense to me from my experience. It's either small pocket size, or if I need a holster rig, then full size.
 

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I have a Airweight JFrame S&W 8 shot 22mag. That’s the smallest I can shoot and mine has a big fiber optic front sight. I can shoot it pretty well. Might be a idea for you cb51.
 

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